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Re: Andrew (post 48,367) (48,387) by Dove from USA Andrew I think *you* are the problem. People are pointing out the flaws in Mariah's performance because they are bullies and want her out. And it wasn't just pointing out, it was big news with contorted images and all. Why does she have to stop just because people tell her to? What if she still has more to give or she doesn't want to stop? She went on national television to sing the greatest Christmas song of all time for the fans, because some of us still want to hear it, flaws and all. AIWFCIY is one of the most difficult songs to sing. We believe Mariah can still deliver great performances because we've heard her do it over and over this past year. Her legacy is not damaged and either is her voice. You say her voice is "irreparable" but the professional in the news segment (post 48,337) said her days of hitting the high notes are not necessarily over. I think I'm going to go with his opinion over yours. As far as her legacy, there's nothing a little good PR can't fix. She's come back from worse before. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 20:36)

1950s glamour (48,386) by Ken from USA Wouldn't Mariah get ripped to shreds for copying Christina Aguilera's Back To Basics look? That's what my first thoughts were anyway lol. I would love to see her pull it off though. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 20:31)

Buy multiple albums (48,385) by Dove from USA I went to lunch with a friend I hadn’t seen in a while and she asked me if I had seen the story about Mariah’s performance. She saw it on the main MSNBC page and thought about me. (The day after the Rockefeller performance, my email blew up with emails from friends I hadn’t heard from in months because they were all thinking about me. Ha ha.) I told her I did see it and asked her if she had heard Mariah’s latest album. She said she hadn’t heard any songs from it and mentioned she only listens to songs that are on the radio, or music her 11 and 13 year old daughters buy. I imagine this is probably common. A lot of my peers have multiple kids now and hardly buy anything frivolous for themselves anymore. I think for those of us who can afford to, if we bought multiple copies of her new album when it’s released, we could find somebody to give them to. I have friends who were huge Mariah fans but now they’re just focused on their kids and don’t buy things for themselves. There's go to be a way to have people buy Mariah's music again. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 19:58)

Re: Getting it off my chest (48,369) (48,383) by Dove from USA I agree with a lot of your points. I don’t agree with just laying down and taking people’s incorrect or disrespectful comments, though. I don’t usually make it a habit to feed the trolls or argue because I would rather avoid the drama and, honestly, I just don’t have a lot of free time anymore. But some of the negative commenters are not trolls or haters, they’re youngsters who don’t know better. Many people, especially young people, read gossip sites and/or comments on videos and articles to form their opinions off of what others think. A lot of us do have grown up responsibilities now but if we each left at least one positive comment a day on her videos that would add up over time. If we sit back and do nothing, pretty soon everyone is going to believe that Mariah is: a has-been, whale, alcoholic, with mental health problems, moo-moo, old and ugly, bad mother, stuffed sausage, dresses too young, worthless because her vocal ability has declined, unwanted because her husband left her etc. You guys have seen the comments on every single article and video. When people read these things over and over, they start to believe and agree. Especially young impressionable people. Mariah’s work is ingrained in us and so we notice the blatant rip off right away but Ariana Grande is their favorite artiste and they don’t know Mariah. They identify with Ariana and take anything negative said about her personally. Kind of like us with Mariah. When we attack Ariana we attack their egos because they have already attached themselves to her. So maybe, gently correct them without disrespecting their favorite. She’s a talented young singer who will probably have tons of success but she is not the next Mariah. For one, because Mariah is still around and has legions of fans who are still interested in her person and work. I’m not ready for working Mariah to fade away yet. We need to do our part as fans. If she doesn’t see any incentive to work, why would she? She’s rich and a mother now. She doesn’t need the constant criticism. I’m not referring to those of us on here who offer constructive criticism because we’re frustrated and want to see her back on top where she belongs. I’m talking about the actual haters. (looking at you Wendy Williams). (Sunday 7 December 2014; 19:52)

AIWFCIY is #11 on Swedish iTunes (48,382) by Baby from Dreamville...Where There's No Beginning & There is No End Yay. Seems even bad press can't hold her down for long. Lol she was just #17 before yet now the song is actually up from the earlier high of #12. Merry Christmas lambs. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 19:44)

Brava, brava twothousandeighthundrednineteen times over, yayMariah (48,381) by Baby from Dreamville...Where There's No Beginning & There is No End TiffMelody, thanks for that post. Sometimes it feels like there are more haters on here than lambs but it's really just the opposite. Thank you to all the rest of you for showing love, support but also appreciation that Mariah Carey is sill here instead of wishing her away. We about that lamb life. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 19:08)

Andrew (48,380) by LC from USA Everyone with a negative opinion or criticism is not a hater, Andrew. Just like everyone who supports and understands is not delusional. I'm just really curious as to how some fans like you think you know everything that goes on in Mariah's life, and assume that we don't see the damage. You've never had her voice, obviously no one has, so how do you know what factors influence it? How do you know she had been resting the whole time? And can't we acknowledge that a Mariah performed live for the fans? She was sad about disappointing them? She couldn't just back out. Her voice has always been fragile, and for her to still be able to sound incredible 24 years after her debut is a huge feat. Her performance was not "horrible", it had some good moments, and the rest was meh. Definitely not her worst, which is why we are so confused as to why this has garnered Whitney style media massacring. It's sad to tear her down like this. She's a legend. Her legacy is set in stone. I don't know why fans like you always think one small thing will tarnish it. As long as she still has talent, her legacy will stay. That's forever, sweetie. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 18:16)

B (48,378) by Abraham from USA I completely agree. Everything you posted would help a lot. New image, vocal coach, new body, new collaborations/producers. However, I love how Mariah looks today. And she shouldn't have to change who she is for anybody. The people who call her names are loser kids and immature men. People have no respect or love anymore. It's sad, but whatever. You know what you are talking about. I'm glad you are still posting here because I love reading your posts. The board needs more fans like you. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 17:59)

Debbie Gibson (48,377) by Jenny from South Africa This is just random info, but I just noticed Mariah has been following Debbie on Twitter before she even started following Brett Ratner, Love B Scott and Kristofer Buckle. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 17:46)

Mariah's voice (48,376) by Ty from USA 25 years later still making news. After her peak, the real lambs know her live performances are hit or miss so we really knew this was gonna be a mess. Now the shade is Mariah is very secretive with her vocals and sound. How did the edited version get released? Lord if she sounds like this December 20th. I'm gonna pile on the drinks to erase the pain. Lambs we need to get these lamb moments together before the shows start. Enjoy your Sunday. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 16:36)

Ariana (48,375) by B from USA She's now coping Mariah's style. Remember the Vera Wang bandeau top and skirt that Mariah wore to the MTV Video Music Awards in 1997? Ariana wears the same ensemble in her Love Me Harder video. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 16:23)

Marilyn Monroe's 1950's glamour (48,371) by B from USA For the next era Mariah should duplicate Marilyn Monroe's 1950's glamour. Chanel, Fendi, Givenchy, Burberry, and Alexander McQueen and stylist Rachel Zoe could transform her into a style icon. Mariah needs to visit Dr. Scott Kessler on a weekly basis, she needs to work with her personal trainer Bernardo Coppola daily, and she needs to take lessons from her mother Patricia, who we all know was an occasional opera singer and is a vocal coach. She also needs new producers and collaborators. She's Mariah Carey. If she went on Oprah, Fallon, or Ellen appearing humble, articulate, and charming and talked about the effect emotional turmoil can have on the human voice and talk candidly about the divorce she can regain the publics sympathy. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 15:30)

Getting it off my chest (48,369) by TiffMelody from USA About this whole "needs to prove herself", please understand that you have to be able to read in between the lines, you have to see the motives behind people. Haters are not attacking MC because they don't know she can sing. They're attacking because they love drama. That's why the media reports it because they know people buy into drama. Why? Because it distracts them from the drama in their own lives. OK. Please understand they already know she's a brilliant vocalist. It ain't news if somebody like Britney Spears (no disrespect) mess up singing, but it is news when a brilliant vocalist like MC messes up. So therefore you don't have to pay attention to these haters, just smile and nod at them and keep it moving. I mean they're critiquing MC like she's auditioning for The Voice or something. She has millions in the bank and platinum album upon platinum. I say she won the contest if there was a contest. And for haters who compare a new artist to MC, let them know that there's no rule that you have to like only one artist, it's OK to like other singers. Please understand that the greatness of an artist is measured by their influence. A new artist has a long way to go to be at MC's level. Anybody who says otherwise, have patience with these folks because they are delusional. The school system ain't what it used to be, objectivity is a problem with these young folks. You're wasting your breath arguing. Just smile and nod and say "reading is fundamental" and keep it moving. When MC was approaching Elvis' record, no way in the world was she under the misconception she was trying to replace his greatness. In fact, she flat out stated that "I am not Elvis". Why? Because Elvis has decades upon decades of influence upon the music culture, MC hadn't finished her second decade of her career yet at the time. So haters with their new "so and so artist is better" are merry-go-weather fans. They're letting the "artist of the moment" marketplace dictate to them who they should like. Now, a new artist may have great potential. I'll give them that, but how may artists with great potential wind up on "Where are they now?" episode off VH1 and you're discussing with your friend "You remember what happen to so and so? Didn't they have that song such and such?" And Bubba goes "I don't know what happen to him. Last thing I heard he was doing an informercial." That's what a conversation about a has been sounds like. Trust me on this, no conversation about MC will go like that. I'm still disheartened about Lauryn Hill. Talk about artist with great potential. She dropped an album that shook the market. I'm still mourning the loss of her. Therefore, these new artists who can hit high note or two have way more to prove if they going to fulfill the shoes of an international legendary singer like MC. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 14:55)

Debbie Gibson (48,368) by Orkun from The Netherlands Actually, I was (still am) a big fan of a song of her. You really should check her out. She came out before Mariah got famous. Both girls are from Long Island btw. If you like Mariah, you'll love this song. It's called "Foolish Beat" by Debbie Gibson. Duet together on this song? Definitely. It's a classic to be rediscovered. And I have to say: Debbie Gibson? Such a sweetheart and such a classy lady. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 13:58)

(48,367) by Andrew from UK Why is everyone with a negative opinion or criticism a "hater"? People are pointing out Mariah's performance because it was awful. She can't sing her own song. This cannot be dressed up in any way. Now the problem is, all of you who keep saying "She can do it, she needs a killer performance, she can still do this and that", well, I'm sorry, *you* are the problem. You are essentially saying to her that she needs to keep trying to do something she can't do or you'll be disappointed. Pressure, much? The voice sounds seriously damaged. There's no resonance or vibrato, it sounds arid and strained and the range extremely limited. Is rest going to fix this? No. She rested for years before the album release. And why did she go on US national television to sit something she must have practiced beforehand and realised "oh, I can't do it"? Because nobody is telling her to stop. Her legacy is now as damaged as her voice, and like her voice, it's a little irreparable. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 13:44)

Debbie Gibson (48,366) by B from USA She was an 80's pop star that wrote and produced her music. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 13:40)

Mariah proving herself (48,365) by LC from USA I have really tried to keep mum about this whole situation because my emotions have ranged from anger to shock to disbelief to sympathy to God knows what lol. I'm known at school as a huge Mariah fan, so you have no idea how many of my friends sent me the video and came up to me at school asking me if I'd watched the performance, as if I wasn't there at 8 o'clock anticipating. Anyway, I don't want to dwell on that too much, but just briefly, I really don't see why there's so much backlash. She sounded a million miles better than Tokyo and last year's National Tree Lighting, but whatever. She's a legend. I don't care about haters anymore. But, I do think Mariah could work this to her advantage. She needs to come back again. How I wish she did the Jimmy Fallon thing this year instead of two years ago because that shut everyone up. I know she still has it, and I'm so thankful she showed it on tour. I hope she can do something, like that video of her whistling, but bigger. More impactful. Slay everyone again, Mariah. We know you can do it. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 3:41)

Slant Magazine - "Butterfly" album review (48,364) by Benjamin Fisher from United States A quiet storm album without the fucking, Butterfly is, above everything, idiosyncratic. Here, like never before, we're asked to take Carey for what she is: unabashedly chaste but ultra femme; unrelentingly precious but undeniably vulnerable. It's this perceived waffling that makes Carey such a divisive pop artist (certainly the girliness doesn't help either, since femmephobia is perhaps the status quo's least-questioned fear). And it's Mariah the inconsistent that makes Butterfly so ultimately fascinating and endearing. Viewing her character from a completely different angle on the album's weepy last track, "Outside", Carey observes that she's "always somewhat out of place everywhere/ambiguous/without a sense of belonging to touch/somewhere halfway/feeling there's no one completely the same". Whether she's talking about her mixed-race heritage, her career, or both, it's the old Carey one-two, a seemingly unhappy ending fueled by the know-thyself philosophy that otherwise makes Butterfly joyous. As Carey's most bizarre moment of self-celebration, it's also a triumph, since it could only make sense coming from Mariah the person. I feel that the writer of this album review, more than anything, really *gets* Mariah and who she is as an artist. Very intelligent written review of an album by an incredibly divisive and often under-appreciated pop genius. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 2:18)

Debbie Gibson (48,363) by Martyn from England, UK I don't post on this board very often because it tends to be rather negative and argument filled. But guys, can we please just talk about Debbie Gibson? I'm guessing she's an American thing because I have no idea who she is, but what an amazing thing to do. The time, effort and passion she put into that post is so commendable, and I really hope that Mariah reads it at some point. The media are constantly pitting strong women against each other. If more women stood together like this instead of playing up to the narrative created by the media (Nicki Minaj feud anyone?) they may back off a bit. I'm done with female artists being treated like second class citizens because of their gender. Male artists don't have to put up with half of this rubbish. Thank you Debbie, whoever you are. What you did was an impressive and important move. Girl power. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 2:14)

Mariah's big oppurtunity (48,362) by M from UK All the panic over her voice is useless, it's clearly a temporary problem she faces and has been facing it for years. She is prone to fall ill voice wise all the time, the human vocal chords are very resilient (my father is a throat doctor). Yes the media are terrible and condemning, but they always have been and Mariah has always risen above it, several times. I don't see this as a negative at all, it's actually an opportunity for her to re-capture the public's attention after a long time separation caused by her close and loyal relationship with the Lambily. If she rests well and plans properly she can sing live again on her own terms and publicly regain what she has lost. Her legacy is unattainable, her talent and artistic mind is endless, her kids are precious, her 500,000,000+ bank balance keeps her safe and taken care of, she is a major philanthropist and she looks 10 year younger than she actually is. There is nothing to worry about. She just has to use this chance wisely and really push through. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 1:51)

X Factor UK (48,361) by Will from England Mariah has been getting a lot of love on X Factor UK recently. I've never heard/watched her songs been sung so many times outside of "Mariah Carey Week" back in 2008. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 1:25)

Everything to prove (48,360) by Lee from UK I guess this is not the 20th anniversary celebrations Mariah wanted for this song. People here are constantly saying Mariah has nothing to prove. I agree, until now. As the saying goes: you're only as good as your last performance. Mariah, now more than ever, has everything to prove. Which is why I stand by my previous post of getting back out there and slaying an a capella version of one of her songs. (Sunday 7 December 2014; 0:02)

Damage limitation (48,359) by Lee from UK The only way Mariah is going to recover from this backlash is to take to the stage again, in a very public context, and sing a capella. Why a capella? As a big f*ck you to the people who released the isolated track. We know Mariah still has it in her. She just needs to practice and nail one song live and a capella. It will have to be a song the public knows though from her back catalogue. If it were me I'd go for My All. (Saturday 6 December 2014; 23:58)

Proving herself / being ripped to shreds (48,358) by Marissa from USA LaCoya, I see what you're saying about Mariah constantly needing to prove herself, but at the same time, every time she gives a good performance only the lambily cares. Nowadays the media only talks about MC if it's regarding divorce drama, diva demands, ill-fitting outfits, or bad performances. Period. Every time MC does something good I hear crickets from all media outlets. I think people are so eager to rip MCs performances to shreds because it's hard to sympathize with the persona that she's created. She's had a reputation for dismissing other talent, diva demands, not caring how her lateness will affect others, etc. so I think the GP feels like her vocal issues are basically karma for her behavior. People that haven't even uttered Mariah's name in 2 years are suddenly so pressed. There has to be a reason behind that. (Saturday 6 December 2014; 23:28)

Mariah (48,357) by Danny Cedar from uk Mariah is a beautiful human being with a gift as fragile as it is precious and we should all remember the joy she gives us in many ways. Her children are obviously priority now over her career as it should be and trying to juggle the level of work ethic that's natural to her offset against being a mum with her personal and professional life under such scrutiny takes a very strong person to comprehend it all. She's doing these shows for us and for herself she's hasn't hair given in and gone away she shows humility and pride eveytime she goes on stage. We should cut her a break and enjoy her life along with her. (Saturday 6 December 2014; 22:31)

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