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Re: With You 5 stars song (84,322) (84,358) by B from USA I love the ooh, shots of Remy playing Confessions and our bodies are blendin part too. (Friday 5 October 2018; 03:30)

Re: GTFO should had been an official single (84,329) (84,357) by B from USA It's still gaining momentum. The views are increasing at a steady pace. (Friday 5 October 2018; 03:28)

With You (84,356) by B from USA I don't understand the hate With You is receiving on this board. I love With You. It's very modern and very Mariah and is her strongest single in years, Ooh, shots of Henny Playing Confessions And our bodies are blendin' Ooh, I'm in love, it's true Yeah, damn I [censored] with you And we all make mistakes sometimes But we muddle through I don't know what I'm supposed to do (Boy) Oh baby, I'm in love with you, it's true With you, you, you, you (Friday 5 October 2018; 03:27)

With You (84,355) by enwar00 from usa Boring. I love GTFO so I'll keep listening and watching that video. Surprised what she followed it up with. Seems lacklustre after the great built up they have going. Just my opinion tho, who knows it may be popular with the gp. (Friday 5 October 2018; 03:03)

With You (84,354) by Chicago Lamb from USA I'm seeing more people in recent memory weigh in on the song, which is a positive. Personally, after a few listens I find the melody is great, the lyrics sweet. And the harmonies are somewhat fresh as they sound like they're coming from an artist who is inspired by Mariah. I think what's letting the naysayers down the most, is the production. Can we get a stellar remix? I think the album will be a bop. (Friday 5 October 2018; 02:21)

Re: A message for Adam (84,331) (84,353) by Deleted from Czech Bill, how could Kelly Price have "boosted" Mariah's voice? It's Mariah's voice we can all hear on the studio cuts, not Kelly's. It's Mariah's voice in the live shows, whether dubbed or undubbed, not Kelly's. The world didn't fall in love with Kelly Price's voice. Check out her cover of Hero on YouTube... doesn't sound anything like Mariah and doesn't have a patch on any of Mariah's performances of that song through the 90's. You're mad if you think that dime-a-dozen mediocrity is the magic behind Mariah's golden voice. A voice like Mariah's can't be "manufactured" and if it could be so easily faked with some simple smoke and mirrors, don't you think they would manufacture Mariah Carey's a little more often? Could prove lucrative considering the kind of cash she has pulled in over the years. Hell, if Mariah's voice were all down to Kelly's magic and a few studio tricks, why didn't Mariah just bring in another Kelly Price soundalike and keep up with the charade? Singers like Kelly aren't hard to find. And what of all the astounding live performances from the debut and Emotions eras before Kelly Price made her appearance as Mariah's backup, when Mariah had male backup singers? As for why Mariah's voice declined after Butterfly, nobody knows for sure. I think it's possible that she sustained some kind of vocal cord injury but I don't think that is at the root of it. My belief is that Mariah resents the very gift of voice that made her an icon and has turned against it, because that once-in-a-lifetime gift which brought her fame and fortune has also caused her terrible inner pain. She was, in my view, already confessing to this when she wrote "Looking In" in 1995. In that song she was trying to make people understand how our blessings can end up imprisoning us. She has abused and neglected her instrument because on some level she resents her fame, resents the pressure of having to live up to the otherworldly standards she set for herself in those first seven years as a singer. I truly believe that for Mariah singing has come to represent a kind of slavery. Whitney was the same. Combine that with psychiatric drugs, which wreak utter havoc on the voice - which as a singer myself I have experienced first hand - and you have the Mariah of today. As for how Mariah has changed as a person, I agree with you, but the bottom line is that none of us really know what she has been through or what kind of personal trauma has brought her to this point. Mariah started out as a passionate but shy and sensitive teenager who froze up on stage at the KMEL Summer Jam and would blush in interviews. That inexperienced girl was thrown into a world of superstardom, a marriage to one of the most powerful men in the music business, and the unrelenting pressures of worldwide mega-fame, media scrutiny, songwriting, recording, touring, interviews, award shows... I believe Tommy on some level was trying to protect her from the destructive influences of fame and the vipers den that is the music business, but he overplayed his hand and lost her. The irony is that when Mariah freed herself from Tommy's control she became a slave to the fame itself and all of the yes-men and sycophants that come with it. Now she goes through the motions, cynical and passionless. I don't think she ever had the temperament to cope with fame... she even admitted as much in a few 90's interviews, when she used to be real. Today Show '91 comes to mind. Can fame change people? Elvis Presley, Michael Jackson, Whitney Houston, and so many more. There are too many to name. We've all seen it happen. Mariah has lost herself and it is heartbreaking but I refuse to let it diminish what she has accomplished as an artist. Truthfully I don't care for anything she has done since the turn of the Millenium, but her 90's voice and songs still thrill me like nothing else can. I hope that she can find herself again. (Friday 5 October 2018; 02:18)

Re: With You about Nick Cannon? (84,323) (84,352) by RibbonB from USA I would agree, even GTFO and I Don't. Nothing is applicable to James. Lol, but people gonna think what ever. The video may or may not tell. On another note watch Nick's trilogy on YouTube. Good noir theatre with K Michelle. Not saying it relates to M, but it is interesting. He and K MIchelle have chemistry working together. (Friday 5 October 2018; 02:06)

History repeats itself (84,351) by Ronnie from California Don't get me wrong, it is a good song. But by no means is this lead single material. I would be perfectly happy with this song as album filler. Regardless, I can really appreciate how ambitious it was and I think it's the right track for a revival of her masterful ability to orchestrate complex interweving melodies. It seems like the melodies she is choosing are not as "mathematically" impressive but I imagine it's due to a combination of vocal fatigue, discouragement, and overall stress. It appears like Andrew was right and GTFO was supposed to be lead. Idk if it is her or the record labels that refuse to break the ILT, WBT 1-2 punch? Or does she just not know her market? Does she think she has the power to change the market? The only question left: is the album like GTFO or With You? (Friday 5 October 2018; 01:58)

Re: A message for Adam (84,343) (84,350) by Atwood from NY Amen to your post. (Friday 5 October 2018; 01:33)

Re: With You (84,313) (84,349) by loverboy from Canada "The deception is what kills me the most. Every Christmas she milk AIWFC for the millions she's earned and tours all over the world pretending to 'sing'. She should not charge full price tickets to watch her lip sync when she can't sing anymore. Either sing in real time with your current limited voice or not at all. It's disingenuous take advantage of the same people who supported you when you put out a quality product and use the same people to fund your extravagant lifestyle and you are giving them a hologram." This this this. While I do like the "With You" and look forward to the album, her lip sync performances during her concerts kill me more than anything. I understand maybe lipping certain parts here and there, but she's lip syncing the big notes/money notes aka the notes that people pay to go see live and the ones that are usually the centrepieces of her songs. It's so fake and really sad to see especially since she has become so reliant on it to keep this facade going. I get her voice isn't what it used to be but like many have said: Change the arrangements of your old songs and stop recording stuff nowadays that you can't sing live. It may not sound as good but at least it makes for an honest live performance. I love her music, I've seen her in concert multiple times (back when she wasn't obsessed with lipping) and have all of her albums singles and videos so it's just disappointing to see it from someone you are such a huge fan of. Ok that's my rant. (Friday 5 October 2018; 01:23)

Try again Mariah (84,348) by Special K from USA Really? I can't believe Mariah came out with an uninspired, recycled over 100 times, tired, layered vocal, weak as hell average song. With You has got to be the worst lead single ever. And Mariah's vocals, oh my goodness her vocals. I'll just leave it right there. I'm not even watching Mariah perform at the AMA's. I can't believe Epic records thought this song was so good that it had to be the first single. Really? Man, I am not even the looking forward to this album coming out. For those of you who was complaining about Mariah working with JD well I promise you I will be praying every day that the rest of the singles on that album are produced by JD. (Friday 5 October 2018; 01:08)

With You critics (84,347) by Bobby A from United States With You is so good. MC15 is going to have some banging tracks to carry the album. So don't fret if you are not feeling the song. Every first single can't instantly win over everybody. Just enjoy that she is still willing to give the world music after almost 30 years. If she retired after MC15, she would be set for retirement. The Poo Bear and Shirellxx tracks are going to be the ones to win you over. Who knows who else she worked with. Send her love today. (Friday 5 October 2018; 01:06)

Mariah can't satisfy everybody (84,346) by Ethan from United States Obviously, WY ain't WBT and not as strong as #Beautiful. It has potential and this is Mariah's 2018 vocals. The 90s is irreversible. It seems like some of us on here are musicians/music experts so I hope you can provide us some demos/beats of the "it" trend now or what direction Mimi should go and we can all provide some constructive criticism. Some of us here suggested her to work with Cardi B and all I can say is "no comment" or "no thanks". There won't be another Music Box, Daydream, Butterfly, or TEOM (which I haven't fully listened to the whole album - it's a different kind of R&B that I haven't got really into it). In my opinion, every artist has one or two peaks in their career and then sing/tour on their greatest hits. That's it. It's like how Billy Joel came out and said he stopped making music or told artists to stop recording new music because their creativity ran out. Then he got criticized for it. It doesn't seem like there's a middle ground here. Do we have higher standards than other artists' fans? Are we gonna look down on Britney's fans and judge them (who kind of sold out residencies and shows) for knowing/letting her lip-synch the "entire" show? Will "lambs" even support and/or go to the show if Mariah does it? At this point, you just need to stay or move on. I understand it's the art of letting go so it takes time. It's vividly emblazoned in your mind and it's just so far like a distant star that you can't do it yet and keep becoming back to this forum to express your emotions . As I've said before, it's not 2005 so let's face it. Even Celine Dion doesn't perform her songs like Loved Me Back to Life and Incredible from her latest album in her residencies now. There were great songs since MHWGO (1999) and none of them was highly charted and/or recognized by the Grammys and such. Nowadays, it's more about performance since people still buy tickets to see you despite your latest record's performance to hear your older hits. In the end, I think it's about longevity. Yes, it'd be great to have another #1 but seriously, where's Dinero, Made For Now, Malibu, Man of the Woods, Queen, etc.? (Friday 5 October 2018; 00:30)

With You thoughts (84,345) by this_is_qhm from the Philippines This right here is a confirmation that Mariah doesn't care about charts anymore. Not only does Vulgariah seem to be in full force for this era (fine with me), but no artist of today with charts in mind would snag someone as current as DJ Mustard and then make him a produce a '00s R&B track that JD could have easily achieved. Negatives: 1. It sounds like a fall release, but is definitely not single-worthy material - not by any standard. 2. It has a chorus that would not even pass as a verse on Mariah's 90's stuff. 3. Many would write it off as boring if mostly due to the familiar background. 4. The lyrics are not universal. 5. The mostly subdued vocals throughout most of the song may make you wish she went harder on the climax. 6. I'll be floored if this catches fire, but I would really love to be proven wrong. Positives: 1. Not caring about the charts means one thing - she really just wants to express herself and keep the casual fans up to speed with what's happened in the last few years. 2. It prominently features her lower register and the melody takes interesting little twists and turns that aren't too difficult for the average listener to mimic. 3. It's a grower and her voice is not as overproduced as it was on some of MIAMTEC. 4. It makes for great driving music - the harmonies and vocal layering are as tight and dreamy as ever. 5. It's quite lovely and its simple chorus will lend itself well to live venues, with the lights down low and phones waving in the air as the audience sings along. 6. The best part is that this sounds like her most honest, heartfelt single in a long time. Despite it not breaking new ground for Mariah, it's saved by the almost palpable love that went into it, and it has the potential to truly touch people who can relate. (Friday 5 October 2018; 00:23)

With you (84,344) by ktktkt from Philippines I love the song. Sounds like "Last Kiss" which is a favorite of mine. (Friday 5 October 2018; 00:19)

Re: A message for Adam (84,336) (84,343) by T from USA Andrew the question is would you be able to objective sales aside? If the album sells 100 copies or ten million will you be able to give it its due? You're saying she needs to deliver now more than ever and maybe she will, all this talk has been based on two songs (out of twelve possibly?). I laugh because I'm reading the comments from the people who aren't satisfied with this first single and they are asking for everything from a dance club song, a hard beat hip hop song and even a gospel song? So right then and there it proves no matter which direction she went, it wouldn't be universally accepted. 90's throwback songs are in now and she has crafted something that fits that genre as well as keeping staying modern. "With You" is anything but lazy and if you think she half-ass'd it then I cannot wait to hear the next song you write, produce and record. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 23:34)

Re: A message for Adam (84,331) (84,342) by Deedre aka MiTodoChop @HBF from Canada Lovely post Bill. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 23:33)

Re: Daydream (84,332) (84,341) by Hector from Mexico I became a fan with the release of Daydream too. I love that album. Melt Away is my favorite. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:49)

Re: Same song, different notes (84,314) (84,340) by jaker20 from US Mariah has lost her creative experimentation after TEOM. After that it was all downhill. The mind, like the body, also ages, and if you don't flex it you will lose it. And we see how Mariah flexes her body which is never (see her need for assistance to walk about what's going on in the mind). Mariah is trapped in her 90s self, as the saying goes, she's now a caricature of her former self. Unlike you though, I am no longer upset. I was upset 10 years ago when she botched the release of E=MC2 singles. I was upset after the cheap promo of Memoirs, the album cover says a lot. Then on Idol during the release of Beautiful, it confirmed to me that she can't shred her own image, she is trapped. So my frustration has become apathy. I know from here on out, the type of songs she'll make are throwbacks, classic Mariah as lambs call it. What we are getting now are beats and lyrics she fantasized in the 90s. She didn't mature or got smarter. This is not the kind of career a music legend deserves. Look at Madonna's creative output for example. Her 2005 Confessions album was vastly mature in lyrics and style, but it's still her and that is 25 year career gap from her debut. Look at Cher. Her 1999 Believe album is so different yet the spirit of 60s Cher is all over it. That's a 35 year career gap. Yet for the past 10 years, Mariah is just playing to her strength, singing karaoke to her own songs, and not willing to take creative risks or new ideas other artists. Personally, that Unforgettable French Montana remix is kind of output, 15 years ago, I expected her doing now. Alas, she's not even credited there. Who knows maybe when she turns 50 she'll get a creative boost. Right now, I'll just accept her limitations, hoping one of her songs gets picked up for power rotation by a station or get viral exposure or something, which in itself is a sad fall from grace. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:45)

Alcohol references (84,339) by Pau from Mexico What's wrong with the alcohol references? She's done it since forever. The moet from The Roof, the patron from Migrate, the bacardi from It's Like That. She drinks, so what? Mariah has a very strong mind, she is a doer not a quitter. 15 studio albums, concert tours. C'mon. If she was going to end up like Whitney, Michael or any other from that unfortunate list she wouldn't be appearing so often in public, working and having her kids, former in laws and other people children around her. She is fine. She is probably more worried about her menopause than having a prescription problem. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:44)

Re: With You - Andrew - nostalgia (84,304) (84,338) by Liz Archer from Sweden Sadly I agree. I was expecting a new sound, something different compared to her past. This feel very like her old new songs. I admit the song is growing on me, but its not the *pow* and glitter I was expecting. It's only OK, and that is not good enough in my mind for a lead song for an upcoming album. I guess I was expecting an up-tempo song with gospel or jazz... just something different. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:41)

With You - my opinion (84,337) by Pau from Mexico I like that it feels personal. Like the beat, really like the Breakdown reference, and she is singing about being in love. When was the last time she wrote about being in love? 2008, right? Too me it feels like she is telling a friend about what has happened in her life lately. Reminded me a littlel bit of Justin Beiber's Love Yourself vibe. Would be awesome if she does an acoustic version. I don't understand why some lambs get disappointed. Neither the harsh critic and negativity. Mariah is an artist and she creates music, sometimes fun, sometimes dark, it all depends on how she feels and what type of stuff she is going through. I read your comments and you write like the world is gonna end because of what she does or doesn't do according to you expectations. I've been a fan since 2015 and was amazed with MIAMTEC. Cry, Faded, Dedicated, MILG, YDKWTD are always on my playlist. With You is not like those gems but different it's not bad. Thank you Mariah for the new music, really enjoying it. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:13)

Re: A message for Adam (84,331) (84,336) by Andrew from UK William, as bored of all the crap as we may be, to say that Kelly Price was "boosting" Mariah's vocals is an unfounded and unfair stretch. Unless there is evidence of this? I know you're upset but keep it real. Drink you're Moet, eat your Chitos outside the kitchen window and call RaeRae. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 22:04)

Re: A message for Adam (84,331) (84,335) by Stacey from USA Well said, Bill. Agree 100%. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 21:59)

Re: With You - nostalgia (84,327) (84,334) by Andrew from UK Straw man arguments abound here. I am not convinced people like you want the truth unless it's your particular version of it. From debut to mid-noughties Mariah constantly changed and each album sounded different, with a different vibe, a different voice but the same signature. Since, and including, Memoirs everything has felt samey and a bit boring, save for the moments of brilliance like Almost Home, Beautiful, YDKWTD. Thus, your argument that people are clinging on to a dream first captured twenty five years ago is moot. You intentionally miss the point. Mariah has always developed changed and surprised with genius. Yet, for many years now, the music is rehashed, lazy, half-assed. This comeback was supposed to be *it*: the long wait over, the big reveal. Alas, prima facie, it's last night's toilet paper covered in last night's shit. Here's hoping, with a due sense of anxiety and dread, for the rest of the record. But high-horse this you may not. Because if you encourage people who don't subscribe to your pill-popping, happy-no-matter-what way of thinking to leave Mariah, you're less of a fan than they are. For you only care about yourself. And not about Mariah. But I fear they are going to go, nevertheless. I don't think an album release of Mariah's has now ever been so important for this reason. I hope she pulls it out the bag. (Thursday 4 October 2018; 21:57)

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