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Hero live MSG 2022 (101,851) by Jamie from UK

I'm the same Bill, very sad. I feel no vocal coaching is gonna fix this. How can this happen?
(Friday 16 December 2022; 12:07)


this is a reply to message		101,849

Supreme songbird (101,850) by Bill from the UK

Just when I thought nothing could be worse than that dreadful remake of this song she did last year.
(Friday 16 December 2022; 11:53)


this is a reply to message		101,846

Hero live MSG 2022 (101,849) by Bill from the UK

I wish you hadn't shared that. I just burst into tears. This is heartbreaking. Something is really, really wrong. What on earth has happened?
(Friday 16 December 2022; 11:51)


this is a reply to message		101,845

Hero live MSG 2022 (101,848) by Sasha from Nomansland

This is really disturbing.

(Friday 16 December 2022; 11:23)


this is a reply to message		101,845

Hero live MSG 2022 (101,847) by Bobby A from United States

The critics are going to rip the CBS show to threads on the 21st. Who knows, maybe the same editor who saved The Adventures of Mimi DVD can make the CBS show watchable. I just don't know. I am really worried about MC's career right now. Who would have thought in 1990 that our beloved Mariah Carey would totally lose her voice?
(Friday 16 December 2022; 10:41)


this is a reply to message		101,845

Supreme songbird (101,846) by MC1989 from Spain

Well, I don't know that Joseph Khan, but if I agree with him. "No one like Mariah", no one could go and do Christmas Baby Please Come Home like this and make you feel like her vocal chords are bleeding. These people don't really love her. Someone who loves her would tell her to go to a doctor as soon as possible. I'm afraid Mariah is going to need a lot of cortisone for her last MSG show.
(Friday 16 December 2022; 09:26)


this is a reply to message		101,830

Hero live MSG 2022 (101,845) by MC1989 from Spain

So this may be her worst performance of her career. It's supposed to be aired on TV in a week. It doesn't matter how they end up editing it, people were there and the videos are all over the Internet.
(Friday 16 December 2022; 08:54)

Supreme songbird (101,844) by Edward from USA

MIAM has some great vocal moments. The whistles on Dedicated are some of her best, in my opinion. "The Art of Letting Go" is the last song I remember she sung in full voice, the climax is just great. Sadly four years later her range had reduced by almost halve on "Caution", and four years after there's almost nothing left. Even though I was quite impressed with her vocals on "The Roof Re-imagined".
(Friday 16 December 2022; 03:28)


this is a reply to message		101,843

Supreme songbird (101,843) by Bobby A from United States

I just realized this today. The last time MC sung her butt off was on You're Mine (Eternal). The highs and lows on the song were executed very well. Wow. That was in 2014. It will be almost 10 years next year. I guess it is time to order me a FYE CD of the You're Mine remixes.
(Friday 16 December 2022; 00:26)


this is a reply to message		101,842

Supreme songbird (101,842) by Terna from Nigeria

Thanks for this, I hope she see this and realizes she's not fooling anyone, we can see it and so can the general public. Honestly, at this point its probably only the surgery that can save and repair whatever damage she's got going on. I always said her vocal issues stem from way back to at least 1994. That first tour did something to her voice. And it's blaringly obvious by the "Daydream" era. Sure she still does sound good, but one can tell already she's lost a good chunk of her main voice, maybe a nodule or something else and ever since then it's been downhill vocally for Mariah. Like Celine Dion, Mariah Should come clean. Enough of the fa�ade already. People want to see you win Mariah, but you've got to want to win yourself too. Get professional help. She's never really worked with a vocal coach and at this point a speech therapist (does she even know new tricks of the trade like singing straws, humming and vocal fry exercises, warm ups for pre shows and cool downs for after shows? etc.) and that's why she's in this predicament today. Smh. I feel so worried for her. Get help Mariah, quit being so damn stubborn and delusional.

(Thursday 15 December 2022; 21:24)


this is a reply to message		101,836

What's going on (101,841) by Will from England

It is quite shocking how bad her voice has become over the last few weeks. Whatever has happened to it is a very recent thing, because even though the quarantine shows/performances were pre-recorded, they actually were quite decent and had strength, fluidity, range etc. unless they were edited to the hilt. Everyone was praising them to some extent. These recent performances, I just can't put my finger on what she's done to have such a drastic change, even her stage presence is way off. It's over the top, even for a Mariah Carey performance. Everything that she knew how to do (breath control, timing, key selection, phrasing) is all off and it's showing. Is it possible that she's had surgery on them already and it's not healed fully? The voice we have currently is not even a distant relative to the one that recorded Caution, and she considered the vocals on that to not be at their best, I doubt she would even be able to sing any song on that album, let alone her classic hits.
(Thursday 15 December 2022; 18:54)


this is a reply to message		101,838

Mariah needs help (101,840) by TheWind from England

Mariah can barely sing a note live. She is talking through some songs, and is barely able to cope with the most basic of runs. Her whistle tones, whether live or prerecorded, do not sound in good shape either. They have lost their clarity, which is a worrying sign, because in years gone by, even on her worst day, she could hit a strong whistle note. Mariah knows what is wrong with her voice. She needs to act on it. We can sit here and type about advice, and suggestions about what to do, but she knows what is wrong. She must have a voice doctor and vocal coach. She needs to do what she is advised to do. Either that, or continue to live as she has been and not take money off of people to attend concerts that are so clearly not live.
(Thursday 15 December 2022; 12:27)

What's going on (101,839) by "MariahHater" from Hell

As far as I have observed, she records the sounds she does live from previous years and adds them to playback to make it more sounding as her current vocal state.

I stumbled upon early 2010s perfromances and I must say, I miss Mariah Carey. The Mariah Carey as a human artist. Not the money making machine we see now. I applaud her efforts to be present everywhere but it pains me to see mediocre performances. I totally understand if she is already impaired. Maybe she is still on the denial stage. We don't know for sure if she already consulted voice specialists and might advised her to enjoy whatever notes left on her chords before she retire at a certain point in time. We really don't know.

But I rather have her do stripped down sets, unplugged raw sessions even if she lowers the key 500 times just to cater to her current vocal state. I'd be willing to pay more to see her in a normal jeans than to see her on a total glammed bot. I really miss Mariah Carey, the human.
(Thursday 15 December 2022; 11:42)


this is a reply to message		101,838

What's going on (101,838) by whisperingmisunderstandings from USA

I'm a long time lurker as well, thought I'd share my two sense about what's going on with her vocally. A lot of fans have relied on the "vocal rest" narrative, the idea that if Mariah would just take a year off, like she did during her pregnancy, or like she did between the Charmbracelet tour/TEOM, her voice would recover. Her voice did sound pretty strained by early 2020, so the pandemic seemed like a perfect opportunity for her to take a break.

Cut to 2022, her live performances this year have proven that vocal rest alone won't cut it. In fact, I think part of what we're dealing with is vocal underuse. The voice is a muscle, and any athlete knows that there's a delicate balance between overuse and underuse. Imagine an olympic runner taking 2 years off, and then one day getting up and trying to run a marathon. They would not be anywhere near their peak performance, as their body would be woefully out of shape. Mariah went from singing around the house/in the studio whenever she felt like it (claiming to have regained her voice fully) to doing a full set list in an arena, and we can all see she wasn't prepared.

So yes, Mariah's gonna need to ease back into live performing, like she did in 2014, starting off TECS tour with some terrible shows (probably her worst up to that point), but her voice gradually gaining strength and ending that year with some amazing Beacon shows. I'm hoping that her voice/confidence will improve with the next NYC show/any further shows next year.

That being said, there's obviously waaaaay more going on here, and others have pretty much hit the nail on the head (not warming up, not putting her vocal health first). Alcohol is clearly a big issue as well, and I can't help but wonder if the botched 2014 AIWFCIY moment actually scared her into sobriety (temporarily), and maybe that's why those Beacon shows were so strong. I hope she wouldn't have to experience another public shaming like that but she's made it pretty clear that she has no intention of changing her lifestyle or giving up her vices so idk (hopefully the CBS special doesn't go viral for the wrong reasons).

As far a playback, I'm not a fan but didn't really mind it used sparingly, on climaxes for super hard to hit notes. But this tour is just ridiculous. Her saving grace in recent tours were the little moments, doing snippets of "Slipping Away", etc. but now she's lipping most of those moments as well, i.e. "Miss You Most". Same with "Away in a Manger", it just felt so unnecessary and like she's depriving the show of a needed organic moment.

I genuinely hope she can get it together and improve. I also understand the fans that just want to enjoy her current output, not focus on negativity, etc. But unfortunately there's not a lot of good to focus on, and I fear it won't get any better/will get worse unless MC wakes up and gets focused on what's best for her voice. But that's just my opinion, so take it with a grain of salt.
(Thursday 15 December 2022; 06:46)


this is a reply to message		101,832

I'm brought to Tears (101,837) by Tevin from USA

Please everyone hear me out. So I was going to vent, get angry, get upset, but at the end of the day as I'm typing this before I go to bed, I realized it doesn't matter. I doesn't matter if the "Yessss Queen" always positive Lambs come up with excuses. It doesn't matter if the negative nacys has their critiques. It doesn't matter if people spend or don't spend there hard earned money to see Mariah live. It doesn't matter if her team and close friends are telling her the truth, trying to help her, or are just using her as a cash ATM machine. It doesn't matter if most people on this message board could now sing a song such as Hero (dare I say it) better than The Mariah Carey can. It doesn't matter if she has vocal nodules, if she hasn't practiced properly for this mini tour, if she did not build up her vocal stamina because she hasn't toured in 4 years. The point of my rant is this, as the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink. What I'm trying to say is this, I don't expect Mariah to sound like the 90s. Heck I don't even expect her to sound like the early to mid 2000's. But from some of the recent performances that she has been doing this year (especially after she said her voice was back and in great shape), we all can see something is seriously wrong. I've never seen her voice give out so many times in a song and it pains me. I firmly believe she can turn this around and put on a decent performance. But as I watch some of the past performances of Mariah, like My All in 2016 and 2018, some of the Caution tour (performances after she had dem babies, for people that used the "pregnancy causes her voice to get deeper" excuse) I'm truly saddened and brought to tears. Not for myself, because we will always have the music, videos and the records. But I'm saddened for Mariah. All fame, money, prestige aside, I'm saddened that just like Whitney and unfortunately Celine to (though not as bad), that the voice that may go down in history as one of the most beautiful, unique, impressive and complex voices in history, is now gone (at least at this time). Whether it's her own fault, or circumstances out of her control (such as medical issues). I just hope that she is able to turn some of this around, not just for our sake but for her own sake as well. Mariah says that singing is her therapy and life, and I just want to see her gain some confidence in her voice and in herself. Her performance doesn't have to be perfect, heck it doesn't even have to be great. I just hope it's good enough that she can feel content with what voice she has left. As much as we don't want to admit it, even though the voice will never be of the 90s again, that same women is still from the 90s, she knows her vocal flaws and mistakes and what she can and cannot do anymore, more than we do. I just hate seeing her look miserable and terrified on stage. If its health issues causing this, like Celine, she should just tell us that she needs time away from singing to focus on her voice or family, whatever excuse. But if its simply a lack of vocal care, then I hope she gets and seeks the help that she needs. By the way, vocal nodules don't cause your voice to go out like that throughout songs, that's caused by things such as not working on your breathing techniques and warming up properly. I firmly believe that Mariah can turn her situation around, if she wants to, but I can't help getting this feeling out of my gut that the last two of the three women that I grew up listening to (rip Whitney), may be semi retiring. I hate to end on a somber note and I hope that I'm wrong, but this may be the end of the vocal trinity (from a live/touring perspective). But at least we have the music and the memories.

Man do I hope I'm wrong.

(Thursday 15 December 2022; 05:48)

Supreme songbird (101,836) by MC1989 from Spain

Sad, but true. I've never seen her struggling like this before. She used to struggle with high belted notes and hard climaxes like many singers do. But since this year's Saudi Arabia performance I really started to worry. Even in her recent tours in 2018, 2019 and 2020 where the raspy parts were there, and she would sing many flat notes, she was still capable of doing a very decent show. But this really hurts. I know she's doing what she can with what she has right now. But again, though I love her, I can't help feeling a little angry and sad for her. There are no excuses. She doesn't work 8 hours as we do. She has a team of well paid people doing whatever she wants her to do for her. She has problems and probably mental issues as most people have, but the difference is that she's a millionaire and she can afford the best doctors, the best vocal coaches, and relearn how to use what's left in her beautiful instrument. She's singing worst than ever, looking more nervous and insecure than ever - but disguised with barbie outfits and allegedly glamorous outfits, lots of dancers, etc- and yet exposing herself more than ever. The Mariah I fell in love with was a perfeccionist. She stopped singing Emotions, Vision Of Love, Make It Happen etc during many years because they were so demanding and so hard to sing. She would sing other songs and though she started struggling after 1997, her agility was insane, her riffs and runs and her musicality were there until not too long ago. But now it feels like she doesn't care, she stands there and sings her hardest songs that she would avoid singing even in her prime, like O Holy Night, Emotions, Fantasy, My All etc and she does it at the worst vocal state. And she knows she's struggling. What she may not be thinking is that singing in higher keys than her range is damaging even more her voice. I can't help imagining Celine, Barbra, Beyonc�, Gaga, Patti Labelle, all partners and great live performers, watching these videos and thinking, wow, she really has lost her voice and she's lipping too much. Considering Mariah doesn't dance, she just walks through the stage and does some girly poses here and there and nervously moves her hand all the time, why do a live concert if the voice is not there? She can cancel. She can say no before going on tour. But I guess the money nowadays is more important for her than what it used to be, even though she's ruining her reputation as a great voice. Which I believe she can still get back if she works hard and regain a part of what she lost.

I don't want her to be perfect, nobody is. I don't even want her to sound perfect as she used to in the first decade of her career. I like in fact her vulnerability as a human being. Her mistakes. Her sense of humor many times. I want her to be honest with herself and her fans. What Celine did last week is an example of honesty as an artist.
(Thursday 15 December 2022; 00:43)


this is a reply to message		101,834

Supreme songbird (101,835) by Lee from USA

Maybe she is singing so hard because you complain about her doing anything else.

(Thursday 15 December 2022; 00:15)


this is a reply to message		101,834

Supreme songbird (101,834) by Bobby A from United States

So what we can really expect is a heavily edited CBS Merry Christmas To All broadcast with the original album tracks. It is going to be interesting on the 20th. MC totally can not sing anymore. It is sad to admit it. The honey butterfly vocals are no more. I don't think even removing her vocal nodules can repair her voice. I wonder what Patti and Stephanie Mills have done after all of these years to preserve their voices.
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 23:21)


this is a reply to message		101,833

Supreme songbird (101,833) by Edward from USA

I'm pretty sure Trey, Tanaka and Mary Ann would say the same. The evidence says otherwise though. Many attendees are commenting that while it was fun, they noticed the struggle on the live parts. Of course as good lambs many are blaming it on the shows in Toronto. Sadly, she won't do anything about until another very publicized new year disaster happen again. If she were to go on tour with her newly recovered pandemic voice with two year rest, she would not make it past 3 shows and she knows it. Don't expect her going on tour after this. At this point it seems she's damaging her voice further trying to sing. I hope she doesn't listen to the sycophants and ass kissers and take care of her instrument, an instrument that has been considered national treasure.
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 22:16)


this is a reply to message		101,830

What's going on (101,832) by Luke from Slovakia

I'm a long time lurker. Hi everybody. Since I don't now any Mariah fans I decided to share my concerns here. I don't mean to be negative but Mariah's vocal state is... bad. What happened? I've just watched live footage from her MSG performance and she sounds horrible. Her performance of Hark the Herald was jus sad to watch. In the end she couldn't even sing she was just catching breath. I really really hope she finally seeks out help. It baffles me that her, one of the greatest, just doesn't care about her voice. What is it with these women just taking the gift for granted? First Whitney and Mariah is getting there as well. Either do some scales before the show or don't take money for performance which is 70% lipped except som uh ohs, and staccato runs. Please Mariah, get some help.
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 21:58)

Who was actually there? Toronto shows (101,831) by Sasha from Nomansland

Uuhhh good argument.

(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 20:52)


this is a reply to message		101,828

Supreme songbird (101,830) by Mariahsbaby from usa

Joseph Kahn who has worked with Mariah on so many videos, my fave is #Beautiful. He has also worked with everyone from Snoop, Taylor swift, Britney to Chris brown.

He wrote this after Mariahs show: "I've been working with
Mariah Carey for over 20 years but tonight is the first time I've seen her live in concert, and I'm blown away. Her voice goes from soul to pop to opera effortlessly in seconds. No one like her. Wow."

[censored]
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 19:30)

MSG show (101,829) by MC1989 from Spain

I hope they have good editors because it was her worst vocal day. I hope she gets medical attention soon. Address the problem to her close circle and go to a specialist. But her close circle would only say yass queen. You did amazing and you sound amazing. How is she going to stop if anyone around her wants to milk her? She even admitted that in the past she felt like an ATM with a wig on. Funny she doesn't see it's still happening. If I were her boyfriend I would tell her, darling, I love you and I want you to succeed, and because I love you I want to tell you the truth of what I hear, you still have a great voice, but you're struggling while singing. Go see this doctor or this therapist or whoever. Touring with this vocal condition is not a good idea. She's really struggling while singing. The hand movements while singing, that in the past felt organic or natural, now are an obvious symptom of feeling nervous, insecure and pretending to seem she's singing live when we all know she's lipping those damn parts. And the lipping it's not good. So my wish is to stop the exposure. Sometimes I think that until she reads really bad press commenting on her vocal deterioration she won't stop. Watching these performances I feel like another NYE disaster is about to happen anytime anywhere. I remember when fans walked away from a Whitney concert during her last tour. I don't want that to happen. But she needs to work hard on her technique, sing more often, rehearse over and over again and stop forcing her instrument like that.
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 17:52)


this is a reply to message		101,827

Who was actually there? Toronto shows (101,828) by Lee from USA

Uhhh, never mind.

(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 16:57)


this is a reply to message		101,822

MSG show (101,827) by Bobby A from United States

It looks like from videos on the web that the December 13th show will be the one shown on CBS on the 20th.
(Wednesday 14 December 2022; 13:49)

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