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Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,829) (100,831) by Bobby A from United States Bill, you really want to hear MC's demo tape. Lol. Me too. I know that's going to be an important scene in the adaptation of The Meaning of Mariah Carey. (Tuesday 26 July 2022; 03:03)

Mariah in the Hamptons (100,830) by Brad from USA Based on MC's posting today, I am wondering if Mariah has made a new real estate purchase in the Hamptons or Montauk? Anyone know? (Tuesday 26 July 2022; 02:59)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,828) (100,829) by Bill from the UK Got my hopes set for The Rarities II You which will feature CB leftover tracks, There For Me, I Lose Control, Skydiving, We're Not Making Love Anymore and the demo tape. (Monday 25 July 2022; 21:46)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,825) (100,828) by Bobby A from United States I just wonder if we will ever hear the leftover track, Reaching For The Sky and others. MC didn't show any MC30 love for Charmbraclet. Maybe it's a reason why she skipped that era. (Monday 25 July 2022; 21:09)

Re: Walter (100,822) (100,827) by Lady B from USA Stacey, don't know if you were referring to me, but it's not "putting him down" to merely tell the truth - that she had 15 #1s without him, all of his (writing credit) #1s were with her, he has zero written credit #1s withouto her (did have 1 production credit #1 though), he hasn't written a #1 hit in over 2 decades and that they had a nice run together. That's it. Not putting him down, just accurately describing his career. (Monday 25 July 2022; 20:58)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,819) (100,826) by Stacey from USA Very good point. Absence does makes the heart grow fonder. See I don't think CB was a failure. I do think MC used the promotion for CB to share her side of what happened. The amount of promotion may have bordered on overkill, but I think she did that much to get as much face time out there to say she is ok and ready to make music again. The album was released to get her back in the game, give an excuse to tour, and get everyone ready for the real comeback which was TOEM. (Monday 25 July 2022; 20:56)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,825) by Bill from the UK Yeh it's probably a combination of what everybody has already said to be fair. Saying that though, how do we think the album has aged? It's definitely a "mood" album, and has grown on me over the years. I don't spin it often, but when I do, I always appreciate the laid back R&B, and I've grown to appreciate the stylistic approach she took to her vocal delivery. Lyrically it's up there with Butterfly in my view. It's odd that Through the Rain tanked in the US, as it was really well received across other markets. (Monday 25 July 2022; 20:41)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,824) by BFF from United States The vocals on the album were very poor quality in my opinion; I find most of the album unlistenable due to this. The only song on the album where she sounds vocally strong is "Bringing on the Heartbreak". I liked a lot of the lyrical content and some of the production choices on the album, but the vocals were just not cutting it. The songs and the album itself were too long, she probably should've cut it to 12 songs. I could've lived without "Boy (I Need You)" and "You Got Me". She also just didn't take enough time off between "Glitter" and this album. I don't think fans would have blamed her. The bright spots of this period were the tour and the fact that she looked really healthy, fit, and confident - especially in 2003 during the tour. She seemed to be taking much better care of herself than during the 1997-2001 period. She was really energetic during the tour performances, moved around a lot, and sounded pretty good vocally. (Monday 25 July 2022; 19:01)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,817) (100,823) by Stacey from USA Hi Dago. No worries. I totally forgot about that. (Monday 25 July 2022; 18:51)

Re: Walter (100,818) (100,822) by Stacey from USA Exactly. I don't understand the need to put him down just because their partnership ended on bad terms. (Monday 25 July 2022; 18:45)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,821) by 123 from USA The single choices and the whisper vocals. Ballads were out of fashion when [Through the rain] came out here in the States. It was all about the r&b and hip hop collabs in 2002, which is funny because she helped popularize it in 95. [...] This was the peak of this formula. The record company should have went with "You got me" as the first single. It was up tempo, the guitar riff was infectious, and it had Jay [Z] on it. The second single should have been Clown to capitalize on the Eminem beef. It would have been played out of sheer curiosity. When TTR and BOTHB were seldomly played, both times the radio DJ stopped the songs mid way and said, I love Mariah but her songs are two [sic] slow and old fashioned. Damn. (Monday 25 July 2022; 18:43)

Re: Thoughts: which album do you think MC dislikes (100,806) (100,820) by MusicfanJ from Germany "She seemed pretty carefree and happy. The tour was a lot of fun. And I liked that her style was super casual." That's right. It was really a cool time as a fan during that time. I became a fan with Daydream as I often said. "Butterfly" was a big surprise and of course genius, but with "Rainbow" it was just so much fun. She was one of the biggest stars out there, but seemed so humble and sweet. Everyone loved her. Her videos were playing all the time on MTV and VIVA (German music TV). I loved the many specials from her, I still have them on VHS. Lol. Good times. (Monday 25 July 2022; 14:09)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,812) (100,819) by Randy from USA I think what sank Charmbracelet is that Mariah didn't go away. She released Rainbow in 1999 with a ton of promotion. Then the Glitter fiasco in 2001 when she was on the cover of every tabloid. Then she promoted the hell out of Charmbracelet in 2002. She needed to go away for awhile so people would care about her again. They would get a chance to miss her and realize why she's needed. Oh and I love Through The Rain, Lullaby and Subtle Invitation. (Monday 25 July 2022; 06:48)

Re: Walter (100,808) (100,818) by Libra Lamb from USA Tell'em Terna! Y'all better recognize that man's talents. You can hate on him all you want but he is very talented and successful, with or without our girl Mimi. (Monday 25 July 2022; 04:14)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,812) (100,817) by Libra Lamb from USA Damn Stacey! I’ve always wondered what made this album so different and your description was right on point! Notice I spelled your name right this time. My name is Dago BTW! Also, when I told you to shut up last year, it was an accident. It was meant towards he who shall not be named, I just happened to reply to your message. Huge misunderstanding Stacey. (Monday 25 July 2022; 04:08)

Re: Walter (100,811) (100,816) by Lady B from USA They had a nice run for sure. She had 15 #1 hits that he was not credited on, so I don't think "she would have had half her career without him", as Terna said, is accurate. He had zero #1 songs that he wrote (did have 1 produced) without her. That's not a diss or bringing him down, those are merely the true stats. (Monday 25 July 2022; 03:07)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,815) by Rashidi Rahim Rick from Malaysia This is my opinion on the reasons why the album sank: 1. The whisper vocals. This album is supposed to be her redemption album after the debacle Glitter era. Why on earth would she go for the whisper route. Just sing and showcase her voice on all the songs. 2. The belting is thin and filtered. Even though she belt certain songs on the album at the end of the songs (Through The Rain, My Saving Grace) but the belting had no ummph because it is so thin. She should do it like Circles, where it the vocals is raw and the belt is thick. 3. Wrong singles choices. She didn't have to go for ballad as first single. Nobody wants to hear a sad song as the opening song for your album. Make it happy and positive. Go for uptempo song, You Got Me. And make the video sweet and happy like at the basketball court where Mariah falls in love with the player. She was at the time wearing a Michael Jordan jersey where she turned it into a cute outift. 4. The album cover. It's so copycat of the Daydream cover, but with colors. She should pick the white dress where she lying down on the grass. It will grab attention. 5. The album title. Name the album as Sunflower. (Monday 25 July 2022; 02:42)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,814) by Bobby A from United States Through the Rain being released as the lead single is what sanked Charmbraclet [sic]. It only made it as high as 81 on the Hot 100. Radio stations needed a fun upbeat MC after the Glitter ordeal. Lyor Choen steered MC in the wrong direction. Charmbraclet [sic] was really all over the place from beginning to end. (Monday 25 July 2022; 02:21)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,813) by Terna from Nigeria The album had fillers, lots of them, lacked tangible single [material] except for "Through The Rain" (which of course was a good start and was needed as she addressed the breakdown indirectly) and wasn't cohesive. Then those hideous vocals. Where was her chest voice? Ugh. Simply put "Charmbracelet" was [bland] and [boring] and quite honestly, my least favorite album. Smh. Such hard times to be a Mariah Carey [fan] 2002-2004. She lost half her [fan] base during this time. I was so disappointed in the record especially her singing and then as if to taunt Mariah fans, Celine's "One Heart" was released around the same time, and was everything "Charmbracelet" wasn't and that's putting it lightly. Lol. (Monday 25 July 2022; 02:11)

Re: What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) (100,812) by Stacey from USA Honestly for me it was the over usage of the whisper vocal. There were so many emotionally charged lyrical moments that called for that full mid upper range voice vocal and she gave me a whisper. CB was full of either whisper or stratospheric belts. I missed that mid range full voice vocal that we got so much of with TOEM. The arrangements for Subtle Invitation and There Goes My Heart are amazing. But her whisper vocals got lost in the music, IMO. There's a moment toward the end of TGMH where she gives a full vocal riff and I just crave more of that over this amazing arrangement. MC is the master of building that tension through the first, second verse and subsequent choruses. Then she blows us away with an amazing bridge and final chorus. I missed that emotional release on CB. I didn't get that release on CB. At the end of the day, I'm grateful for CB. It gave MC a time to shine, to write songs which helped her emotionally release with what happened the past few years and set up her big comeback with TOEM. I saw MC on her last tour date of CB in 2003. She sounded amazing. I love I Only Wanted and Irresistible. (Monday 25 July 2022; 01:49)

Re: Walter (100,808) (100,811) by Stacey from USA Amen Terna. Well said. I especially loved this part of your post, "We don't have to bring others down in order for [MC] to shine, she does that already without effort." I challenge everyone here to look at Emotions, Unplugged, Music Box, Daydream, and Butterfly. Look at each song on each album and count all the times Walter is mentioned. Walter and MC had a magical connection. Let him enjoy that success. At the end of the day, I'm grateful for the music I get to enjoy everyday. (Monday 25 July 2022; 01:31)

Re: Just Stand Up (100,809) (100,810) by Bobby A from United States Lol. Just trying keep those fire whistles notes on the down low. I love this gem. (Monday 25 July 2022; 01:00)

Re: Just Stand Up (100,800) (100,809) by Terna from Nigeria You call those whistle notes subtle? That was pure fire. I've been playing this song ever so frequently of late and yes Mariah did her thing and I always felt the line she sang, she was the best person to sing it. "You will know that you're good if you trust in the good, through whatever" chills every time. The highlight of 2008 in music for me was this song. (Sunday 24 July 2022; 21:45)

Re: Walter (100,795) (100,808) by Terna from Nigeria Hey, what were not gonna do here is disrespect Walter Afanasieff. It's just not going to happen. Walter was already an established pianist and music producer by the time Mariah Carey came along. You better check that man's body of work, before you come on here to display your ignorance. Yes we love Mariah, but we don't have to bring others down in order for her to shine, she does that already without effort. This doesn't mean people she has worked with are any less credible or legit in their own endeavors. Walter and Mariah had magic not just chemistry and the songs they created from scratch speak volumes. Her best songs are the songs she wrote with him, there's no denying that, and if you take away all those songs, she will have less than half the career she has now. Yes, he didn't really recreate that magic with other artists after they fell out, but that also applies to her also. Her biggest "cash cow" song so to speak - a gift that keeps on giving is "All I Want For Christmas is You" and that's co-written and produced with Walter. The man is a genius. (Sunday 24 July 2022; 21:17)

What sank Charmbracelet? (100,807) by Matty from Vancouver Canada So Charmbracelet was the album that moved the dial for me from my mom's adjacent Celine Dion/Barbra [favourite] to Mariah is [my] personal [queen]. The question is: what [sank] Charmbracelet? [I'm] listening to it now on [vinyl] and the only reason I can think it sank was the horrible album art (the worst of all album covers she's done, I don't read what she was trying to convay), and she was introducing us, the public, to her whisper voice. Aside from the hate in this platform has for "Boy" (which I personally loved blasting, bumping in my [parent's mini van] at 16) the tracks are solid. The songs and lyrics are beyond superior. So what sank it musically? (Not breakdown [Glitter] sabotage, I'm talking musical.) (Sunday 24 July 2022; 18:30)

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