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I admit (89,571) by Joachim Agerup Løkkevik from Norway I admit that posts longer that what seems to a full page in a book are not read. Is anybody else here like me? That when the post is almost a masters degree in lenght, you skip it. (Monday 13 May 2019; 07:54)

Caution Unplugged (89,570) by Rashidi Rahim Rick from Malaysia I think it's about time Mariah does a tv performance and call it "Caution Unplugged". This tv special may helps with the streaming or sales of her album. She can do 6 or 7 songs plus an interview, so approximately am one hour show. (Monday 13 May 2019; 04:40)

Re: It's Like That (1993 Remix) (89,568) (89,569) by Hector from Mexico Love it. Great remix. Sometimes fan remixes are far better than the official ones. (Monday 13 May 2019; 02:47)

It's Like That (1993 Remix) (89,568) by Bill from the UK Found this fan made remix of It's Like That on YouTube. Set to a hilarious video of Oprah dancing, and remixed to sound like it was straight out of 1993. This version could have been on Music Box haha. (Sunday 12 May 2019; 23:09)

Mi amiga (89,567) by Andrew from London UK "First of all, it's obvious my English is not the best." Your English is excellent. "You made the Thessaurus joke before with other people so try another one." Please tell me the post number as I am sure I have not. "[S]o I don't get your offensive tone and prepotent attitude towards me." It's perfectly acceptable for you to state your opinions. It is even more acceptable for those who disagree with them to deny their validity. "I supose that's due to your lack of maturity." I would hope my erudition shows I am far from immature. You are confusing immaturity with having a sense of humour. Laugh a little, amiga. "Sooner or later life will teach you a little humbleness." Yeah, you aren't prepotent at all. "[T]hat uninformed idea about men having even more difficulties than women (hello again, unadmited sexism)." You are steeped in irony. The problem with progressives and intersectionality is that you label everyone who doesn't get on board with your new world theories as being of bad character. Everyone is unintelligent for not subscribing to this new way of thinking and absolutely some sort of "-ist", apparently. I said it was *arguable* that men are worse off. Let me mansplain: men have much higher rates of suicide and incarceration, get harsher punishments for crimes of the same nature, have a much higher rate of deaths in the workplace, are solely subject to military conscription, have to retire at a later age, almost always lose custody battles of children, and so on. "You know very little about the real situation in the queer community." I am on a Mariah Carey messageboard. 2 + 2, amiga. "Again, you speak from your uninformed point of view, speaking from your privilege as a white cisgender European man." Please reference my previous post relating how people who subscribe to this hierarchy of victimhood often become less tolerant of views and the people who hold them. You are clearly being racist here. My race and sex have nothing to bear upon my ability to perceive and comprehend facts. You have used my race and sex against me to dismiss me. It makes you a racist and sexist. Cheers for proving my point so effortlessly. And further, you yourself are a white, "cisgendered" European man. Ergo, you must be wrong about everything, also, right? "May I remind you that Stonewall riots were started by black transgender women." The problem with your way of thinking is that rather than encouraging equality and full participation in society, you group people together and constantly label them as victims. How patronising. And not at all progressive. "You probably think Judith Butler - I bet you don't even know her - and the gender theories are bullshit." Finally, you are right about something. But thank you for the word "theories". They are just that. Theories. Not fact. "You assume that I regurgitate other people's theories and opinions without knowing me." This is not an assumption. You are spouting theories that are relatively very new. You did not come up with them yourself. To accept such ideas as axiomatic without question, argument or debate suggests a desire for you to *want* them to be true, regardless of plausibility. A bit like everything B has ever said. "Gender, not biological sex, is a social construction, but I'm not gonna lose my time and bore you and some conservative people on this board because my aim is not changing anyone's mind." That was the exact aim of your original post. And if having two genders is a social construct, you infer that there are limitless genders. If so, a gender is, indeed, an *idea* rather than a fact. And ideas are open to criticism and derision. "And by the way, I'm not your friend." Well, then we're keeping Gibraltar. Essentially let me end this with one sentence: "Oi, Madonna. Grandma. Put some effing clothes on." Meanwhile, back at the ranch, someone called Mariah Carey once failed to release a song called Migrate as a single. Discuss. (Sunday 12 May 2019; 15:38)

Re: Mi amigo (89,563) (89,566) by MC1989 from Spain First of all, it's obvious my English is not the best, but I would like to see you speaking in Spanish or Galician, Portuguese or French as I do, without any help from a dictionary. You made the Thessaurus joke before with other people so try another one. Apart from that, do you know me? Well then eat your judgemental opinions on me. I've defended you many times on thins board, so I don't get your offensive tone and prepotent attitude towards me, but I supose that's due to your lack of maturity. Sooner or later life will teach you a little humbleness. Lastly, after reading your post I realize that you know nothing about the real situation about sexism and women in the world, with that uninformed idea about men having even more difficulties than women (hello again, unadmited sexism). You know very little about the real situation in the queer community. Again, you speak from your uninformed point of view, speaking from your privilege as a white cisgender European man. May I remind you that Stonewall riots were started by black transgender women. You deny the existence of "cisgender" people and I bet that you think "genderfluid people" is another invention that sounds cool and enlightened. You probably think Judith Butler - I bet you don't even know her - and the gender theories are bullshit. You assume that I regurgitate other people's theories and opinions without knowing me, well, again, I feel sorry for you and your lack of knowledge and your prepotency. Gender, not biological sex, is a social construction, but I'm not gonna lose my time and bore you and some conservative people on this board because my aim is not changing anyone's mind. I was just demanding respect, and everything I said was related. And by the way, I'm not your friend. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 19:22)

Nonsense (89,565) by Joachim Agerup Løkkevik from Norway Us arguing about Madonna has come to the level of us argueing about Mariah. Can all the Madonna fans take their sh** to a Madonna Archives board, please? Let's be honest, a 60-year old in teen clothes is never sexy. Look how classy Mariah have become, beautiful gowns with sexy slits, what an act. I doubt Mariah will perform in a bikini when she's 60. But what do I know. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 15:05)

Re: Madonna's BBMA performance (89,540) (89,564) by Andrew from London UK "Well since you put it that way, honey I'm gon stay." Dammit Jade, I'm gonna be singing that song all day. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 13:07)

Mi amigo (89,563) by Andrew from London UK Man (and yes I just assumed your gender) I normally like your posts but you've driven over a cliff with your very weighty English thesaurus and I fear you will struggle to come back up for air. Were a man to sexualise himself so at 60 to a room full of teenagers then he would equally be lambasted for it. It is neither original nor clever to play identity politics and even less so to fixate on a hierarchy of victimhood designed by people to remove themselves from fair competition. To regurgitate theories of intersectionality because it's currently cool to do so is not clever at all but you are entitled to your opinion - even if it is merely someone else's opinion you have adopted because you think it makes you seem enlightened and in spite of the fact that people who make intersectionality their starting point normally become more intolerant and oppressive than those to whom they claim superiority over. There are only two genders. If people do not feel like they are either one good for them, but nobody is "cisgendered", that's just semantic nonsense fabricated by people desperate to push their agenda and way of thinking onto others. Society is hardly patriarchal given that no law exists in the West that give a man one single right more than a woman and men can be argued to have harder lives than women, even where they make the same life choices, which they rarely do. Everyone ages and their behaviour is expected to alter with age and as you get older so too must the age of the people you date or your intentions and mentality will be questioned. It is also required that you carry yourself with increased levels of integrity and dignity as the years go by. Sexualising yourself to young people at 60 is morally reprehensible as is having toy boys in their 20s who would not look twice at you were you not rich and famous. The requirement to mature in behaviour is a societal necessity. When Mariah took her clothes off in 1997 it wasn't sexism that made people feel awkward, it was the questioning of her mentality. Nobody asked her to sexualise herself, nobody wanted it. It wasn't the artist she had been nor why she had been successful. Then in 1999 she adopted a precious princess persona and the general populous and media lost almost all respect for her. Add Glitter into the mix and the vanity train was destined to be derailed by a public who have expectations about behaviour and attitude. For anyone to claim that it derailed because Mariah is female is nonsense. A man would have equally been treated the same way. Some people can own sexuality in a positive, affirming way. With Mariah it came across as vapid attention seeking, harmful to feminism in that she seemed, and evidently still does seem, desperate to be affirmed by the sexual attention of men. Even when overweight and her sexual attractiveness airbrushed into a lie. As for Madonna, nobody wants a 60yo woman, or indeed man, to be sexual in front of young people. And that may be "ageist" to people who scream under banners about how everyone else must view the world, but that does not mean it is wrong. There are just some realities of human psychology that no amount of Cultural Marxism can do away with. And, also, Madonna's face looks like she's gone into anaphylactic shock. Whilst being stung by bees. Ain't nobody got time fo' dat. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 12:47)

Re: Crave (89,559) (89,562) by Randy from USA What's funny about this is that this was the title of her imprint with Sony that didn't last. What makes me mad is she said she named it after a song she wrote called Crave. She said she would talk about the song and its meaning one day. And we never heard about it again. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 12:14)

Re: Crave (89,559) (89,561) by Dennis from Miami, FL I am sure that veteran artists are not getting promotion because they get bigger share of profit and the record companies prefer to work with beginner artists. I've heard that the beginners are getting 25%, the rest goes to the record company. Mariah is a veteran, she or her equals will not agree to 25/75 agreement. So there is no incentive to promote them. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 12:10)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,555) (89,560) by Bill from the UK Cool it. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 11:03)

Crave (89,559) by Norman from USA Madgr has a new song out with Swae Lee called Crave. And I swear it could easily fit into Mimi's Caution album. If this song or any of Mariah's songs from Caution were released by any other current female acts, they would get air play. I'm not saying #1 or anything, but at least top 20. Ageism is bish. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 10:36)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,550) (89,558) by Tijl from Belgium You do have a point there but that is the way the world turns. It always has and always will. Maybe nowadays more than ever. One can be angry about but it is not going to change. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 10:13)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,545) (89,557) by B from USA But it is. Madonna's career is controversial and scandalous, always has been, still is even though she's 60. Here's a link. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 03:11)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,554) (89,556) by Lee from USA Amen. Besides, we would not be so hard on Madge's behind if she didn't started this feud over 20 years based on a British tabloid lie. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 00:54)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,554) (89,555) by MC1989 from Spain Gobbledygook? I know your act, dahling. I know how to distinguish sexist and ageist comments ("she looked like my mother trying to be sexy", "she's too old for doing that", "she moves like an old woman", "a woman must be classy", etc) from comments based on a personal taste. You can like or dislike the outfit, the song, her dancing, whatever, but when those opinions are accompanied with those kinds of comments, they're reflecting how our patriarchal society influences people on their vision of how a woman should or shouldn't dress depending on her age. You know what happens? The funny thing is that a woman can be or act sexy while she's attractive to men and fits the conventional male gaze representations of women. And preferentially if she shows a submissive and girlie attitude. Madonna always played with her sexuality and she used it as a reclame many times, but the difference is that most of the times she did it with a very different attitude than most pop females singers do nowadays (just watch Madonna's "Express Yourself" video and then watch Ariana Grande's "7 Rings"), she owned her body and her message was that, do what you want with your body for you, enjoy your sexuality and have sexual pleasure (something historically denied for women, still a big taboo in many societies), and I believe most times she didn't do it for the male gaze but to provoke in a time where Catholic Church among many other conservative institutions had a lot of weight and power. In our gerontophobic and sexist world, when a woman has children, showing her body and enjoying publicly her sexuality is seeing negatively, unless you do it like if you're in a porn movie for heterosexual men. When female artists pass certain age it seems they must stop enjoying and expressing their sexuality or using revealing outfits otherwise general public will condemn and reject them. I can criticise Mariah for wearing a bikini while singing "O Holy Night" because it's the wrong context and the wrong song for that, but if she wants to sing "Honey" in a swimsuit it's ok for me. I can criticise the outfit if it doesn't look good to me (the angel wings during her Christmas shows), but not basing my opinion on how she should wear according to her age. I would like to see some of you guys in, let's say 10 or 20 years, with your beautiful wrinkles and your grey hairs talking in public about how horrible is to see an old woman like *Madonna* (insert other artist's name) dancing and flirting the way she does, because she should be wearing a classy gown and move like a classy lady and then going home seeking desperately for sex in *Grinder* (insert any other App for meetings) to comfort your depression because you feel rejected by this ageist society. (Saturday 11 May 2019; 00:07)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,545) (89,554) by Deleted from Czech Cisheteropatriarchal? We using made up gobbledygook now? If a 60 year old man behaved the way Madonna behaves on the stage, it would be just as ridiculous, and people would be a lot less coy about saying it. Bad taste is bad taste. (Friday 10 May 2019; 23:16)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,552) (89,553) by MC1989 from Spain Very well said. (Friday 10 May 2019; 22:47)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,550) (89,552) by MusicfanJ from Germany I don't care if an older woman or man dresses like a teen or very young adult. They must feel comfortable. But one great thing is (if you're a grown-up) or getting older, you don't need to stress yourself with trends (like in highschool, for example). I like Madonna's Evita and the movie song. Plus Frozen. The 80ies songs on the radio are ok too. But I still don't like her pirate outfit and the over-sexualized videos. That's not because of her age. It just a matter of taste. (Friday 10 May 2019; 22:25)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,547) (89,551) by Stacey from USA Haha, me too. (Friday 10 May 2019; 20:33)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,547) (89,550) by MC1989 from Spain Oh wait, then you must think that's a stupid and invented word that I used just because it sounds cool. So you're denying that we, cisgender people, have privileges over non binary people who are killed, mistreated and discriminated every day all over the globe? You don't see the rigidity of gender in our society, the real implications of "two and only two" when it comes to sex and gender categories? You probably deny that we live in a society where heterosexuals have authority and privileges over cisgender females and over other sexual orientations and gender identities, where LGBTI people are discriminated and persecuted. I suppose you stop reading because you're unable to see the connection between that term, the patriarchy and its implications, one of them the lack of sorority between women and the amount of daily microsexisms that we have to see or hear, like saying that "a woman is too old for wearing this or that". (Friday 10 May 2019; 20:28)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,545) (89,549) by Billy from Greece Super great post and finally a well-informed perspective. (Friday 10 May 2019; 18:25)

Madonna BBMA so called performance (89,548) by Joachim Agerup Løkkevik from Norway Ok, so I took a look at Madonna's performance. First I will say that I don't share the same hate for Madonna as many Mariah fans do, I love some of her songs. As a child I listened to Cherish, Like a Prayer and Vogue, I have respect for her. But as I have said here before, I actually think Madonna has an anti social personality disorder. I honestly think her performance was horrible. It was like looking at my own mother trying to be sexy and flirtatious. The performance was cringe worthy. Mariah made the venue into a church, the roof lifted under Hero. What is Madonna trying to express with that song? Really? (Friday 10 May 2019; 18:14)

Re: Please respect Madonna, avoid sexist comments (89,545) (89,547) by Bill from the UK I stopped reading after "cisheteropatriarchal society". (Friday 10 May 2019; 18:03)

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